Sage...

[Galadriel]

Hello Sage,


I know your basically like a therapist/counselor type person, and I was wondering if you saw this thread and had any idea at all or any inkling as to what it could be? If theres a name for it or something?? Thank you much appreciated...[img]smileys/smilies_01.gif[/img]Its called "OT....nervous disorder?"


http://www.emetophobia.org/forum/for...sp?TID=1121&am p;PN=9

[sweetfreak]

I think what you are referring to is derealization. Maybe this link will help.


http://www.panic-anxiety.com/deperso..._derealization .htm

[Galadriel]

Hmm, Im not sure that is quite it. I don't feel as tho I am in a haze or that there is like something between me nad the world. Its not quite like that. I feel HERE (like physically and mentally here) but just not like ME. I mean that description of it seems to be like those people have trouble connecting with the world (they feel they arent really touching things, or they feel they are very deep "inside" themselves), but thats not quite what I am talking about. Hmm, interesting tho...

[Galadriel]

It sounds like a dissociative disorder, but Im not sure what one. There is dissasociative identity disorder, but that would be like assuming different personalities, and I dont do that. I mean I am my own personality, its not that deep. Hmm.....[img]smileys/smilies_05.gif[/img]

[sweetfreak]

Hmmm, I think you were looking at the first definition of depersonalization. Look at the second one for derealization. It mentions feeling spacy, or like looking at the world through a veil, but not feeling separated from yourself.

[Galadriel]

Well, thats the thing, I dont feel spacy or like Im looking at the world thro a veil, its not really like that. Its more like I just dont feel like ME, but I feel very much "here". Hmm...hard to esplain.

[Galadriel]

Just bumpin up for Sage...

[sage]

Hi Galadriel,


Sorry - I've been away over 3 weeks. But I finally saw this!


The disorder is actually a symptom of other anxiety disorders and it's called "dissociation" (sometimes incorrectly called dis-association). Dissociation can take many forms like what some of the others described, but also what you described. It's part of the fear system of our brains and it's used for a sort of "numbing" effect. It can happen when we're hit bang-on with the stimulus (that's what happened to me - I'd run away at lightning speed, then feel this sort of floating or "blackening" feeling...sometimes it felt almost like a roar in my ears but with no sound - VERY hard to describe). At other times it can just come on under times of stress or even out of the blue like a panic attack.


The best "cure" for it is to be aware of it, and what it is. Some therapists suggest noticing the feeling of your feet on the ground. "Grounding" yourself in reality, so to speak. Other calming skills are helpful as well.


The main point is that it's not harmful, and you're not crazy if you experience it. But it is indicative of serious symptoms of the phobia, and of course some sort of treatment would be most helpful.


Next time you feel like this just say to yourself (once you become aware of it) "oh hello - this is just dissociation again...it's ok. I'm perfectly fine".


If you panic right after you do this, that would be normal too. Cuz the dissociation is almost a "worse" stage than panic...so you kind of downgrade to panic if you know what I mean.


Remember that panic shuts down the vomit response, as does dissociation. You will not be sick because you're dissociating or panicking.


Hope this helps - and better late than never.

[Galadriel]

Hey Sage!!!


Im glad you found this!! Well, its a hard thing to explain, but it is not related to emet I don't think. It just does it on its own, and always has. I feel like its constantly with me (day in day out) but it has no relation to the emetophobia or any other phobia that I can tell. I'm not afraid of it, its just always been there, and its annoying, I just would like to know how to get rid of it, or make it stop. I'm really very used to it, I just wonder why its happening and if there was a name for it, which sounds like as you said dissociative or some form of it. I wonder why I felt the need or my brain felt the need to start doing that? It seems like Ive had it ever since I can remember, and its always puzzled me, but never really scared me or anything.

[sage]

Yes, I guess it's not emet-related (necessarily), but it is anxiety-related, and quite common. If bad enough, I think it's called dissociative disorder...hang on checking DSM-IV...ok it seems like there are a number of dissociative disorders, but the one closest to what you describe is probably "depersonalization disorder" (not saying you have this, just that the symptoms may be similar) In order to have a diagnosis of the disorder, you have to have the following symptoms:
<UL>
<LI>a lasting or recurring feeling of being detached from pt's own body. pt. feels like an outside self-observer, as if in a dream</LI>
<LI>throughout the experience the pt knows that this is not really the case</LI>
<LI>phenomenon causes clinically important distress or impairs work, social or personal functioning.</LI>
<LI>not explained by another disorder (acute stress, panic disorder, etc.)</LI>
<LI>not caused by a general medical condition</LI>[/list]


It is important to note that about half the general population has had at least one episode of this, so it's not like you're a freak or have something else wrong with you. In fact, you can't be diagnosed with it unless the symptoms cause impaired functioning or acute distress.


"People with this disorder commonly experience derealization, which can be defined as a feeling that the sense that the exterior world is unreal or odd..."


The disorder is precipitated by stress (that would fit most emets!), usually begins in teens or early 20s. Not much is known about this by the psychological community...other than it exists.


Now it's me talking again...I guess the treatment for it is any treatment that will address stress/anxiety. It is not a harmful condition, as you have already realized. Probably just another symptom of having an anxiety disorder in general.


If I can recall some psych classes I think it's most common in people with a history of sexual abuse, (or probably physical abuse, too - but less common) where the pt (patient) had to dissociate during the abuse to protect the self...then it just flashes back over and over again I guess as a way of "coping" with life events - this coping would be subconscious, of course and not just showing up when something happened, but any old time at all. The best treatment forabuse would be a person-centered (Rogerian)therapy over a long-term. For this therapy to work, the relationship with the therapist him or herself is central and imperative. In other words, it only works if you really like and trust them.


Again, not saying any of this applies to you personally, just reporting the info - it may help some others who can identify with it.

[Galadriel]

Hey Sage,


Thanks for the info. I actualy was looking at sites about dissociative ID, and yeah I do in a sorta way fit a bit of it, but its not quite, and I was just wondering if there was a more specific description to describe it.


During these "eposides" which really just is all the time(!) I can't even distinguish anymore, its like my life is one big episode of it. But like I mean I noticed the description was like "feeling out of touch with the world around you, feeling in a dream, in a haze" and I feel very real and very HERE, I mean I dont feel out of touch like physically or mentally, I feel very much here, but its like well, its odd to talk about, but its like I don't feel like ME like I mean I know Im me but its like as tho, well as William puts it "like you almost feel like youre looking thru someone elses eyes", I mean I feel like well, we call it the "whose arm is that?" syndrome lol!! Cause it feels like well, I suppose in a way like your "disconnected" from your self, but your still there. Man its hard to explain. I just wonder what happened to make it start. The thing is it seems to have always been with me, I mean its almost like perpetual. I don't think Ive had any sexual abuse as far as I know. Its probably just some weird way my mind has reacted to things as a child. Is it like a self defense mechanism of the brain or something??

[sage]

ya - that's a good way of describing it - a defense mechanism. And who knows how any of these things start. Our childhood memories are shady and vague even for the best of times. Add any sort of crazy parents and memory becomes very confusing.

[Galadriel]

Yeah I suppose it would be impossible to determine what caused it, I mean that would be really hard to figure out. I just wish my mind could know it doesn't have to do that anymore! I'm just not sure how to get it out of that mode I guess, and its hard to know how to get it out of it if I don't know how it got into it in the first place.

[-celeborn-]

Well, like Im thinking back and I specifically remember the first episode I had being the summer I was 12


I was outside on the sidewalk and like It seemed to just affect the way I was seeing things...there werent any emotions attached except that when it didnt seem to be going to stop, I got a little anxious with it.


but that year, mom had left the man that raised me......he was an alcoholic and I was so relieved when she did get us away from him BUT.......BUT......[img]smileys/smilies_04.gif[/img].....then she found this boyfriend who was a drunk and started drinking herself which caused me a lot of distress.


For me it was on and off for years up till I was late 20s at which point it became more like Galadriels and was a nonstop, 24/7 thing that almost just seemed like life after a while.


It keep going right up until I got sick bad with a Porphyria attack at which point I had to get rid of ALL the stress in my life because stress is a major trigger for AIP.


I havent had it hardly at all since 2001.....but I notice I can tigger a spell of it on my own just by focusing on certain things like Laura says faces seem to trigger her ......or at least make it worse.


I can trigger mine more with say causing that deja vu feeling by seeing something familiar, then getting too focused on it.......it brings a spell on every time if I do that.


Thanks for theinfo Sage... You mentioned sexual and physical abuse....do you think that maybe severe emotional abuse might also be a cause?


I ask this cuase I know i was never abused other than emotional......and i noticed mine grew worse as I was being abused ''emotionally'' at the job I was at few years.

[sage]

Yes, Celeborn. Severe emotional abuse is just as harmful to a child (who later becomes an adult) as sexual or physical. Because the child "knows" (instinctively/subconsciously) that he or she will die without parents to look after him/her. So if parents are abusive in any way, the child blames himself, because to blame his parents would mean there is something wrong with them, and then he will die. This is how we all end up with neuroses or psychoses of various kinds - it's really only a matter of degree, because no parents are perfect so every child grows up believing to some degree or other that there is something wrong with her.The worse the abuse, the more you feel this way. If it's bad enough, you'll dissociate from reality altogether (sociopathic behavior with schizophrenia). I guess we neurotics can thank God we're only neurotic and not psychos...


Again, there is treatment for this which will help. But again, I understand that it's difficult to find good people, and impossible for most folks to pay for it. There's no justice in this world, I swear.